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-[[!meta copyright="Copyright © 2012 Free Software Foundation, Inc."]]
-
-[[!meta license="""[[!toggle id="license" text="GFDL 1.2+"]][[!toggleable
-id="license" text="Permission is granted to copy, distribute and/or modify this
-document under the terms of the GNU Free Documentation License, Version 1.2 or
-any later version published by the Free Software Foundation; with no Invariant
-Sections, no Front-Cover Texts, and no Back-Cover Texts.  A copy of the license
-is included in the section entitled [[GNU Free Documentation
-License|/fdl]]."]]"""]]
-
-[[!tag open_issue_hurd]]
-
-Seen in context of [[libpthread]], but probably not directly related to it.
-
-
-# IRC, freenode, #hurd, 2012-08-30
-
-    <gnu_srs> Do you also experience a frozen hurd console?
-    <braunr> yes
-    <braunr> i didn't check but i'm almost certain it's a bug in my branch
-    <braunr> the replacement of condition_implies was a bit hasty in some
-      places
-    <braunr> this is why i want to rework it separately
-
-
-## IRC, freenode, #hurd, 2012-09-03
-
-    <gnu_srs> braunr: Did you find the cause of the Hurd console freeze for
-      your libpthread branch?
-    <braunr> gnu_srs: like i said, a bug
-    <braunr> probably in the replacement of condition_implies
-    <braunr> i rewrote that part in libpipe and it no works
-    <braunr> now*
-
-    <braunr> gnu_srs: the packages have been updated
-    <braunr> and these apparently fix the hurd console issue correctly
-
-## IRC, freenode, #hurd, 2012-09-04
-
-    <braunr> gnu_srs: this hurd console problem isn't fixed
-    <braunr> it seems to be due to a race condition that only affects the first
-      console
-    <braunr> and by reading the code i can't see how it can even work oO
-    <gnu_srs> braunr: just rebooted, tty1 is still locked, tty2-6 works. And
-      the floppy error stays (maybe a kvm bug??) 
-    <braunr> the floppy error is probably a kvm bug as we discussed
-    <braunr> the tty1 locked isn't
-    <braunr> i have it too
-    <braunr> it seems to be a bug in the hurd console server
-    <braunr> which is started by tty1, but for some reason, doesn't return a
-      valid answer at init time
-    <braunr> if you kill the term handling tty1, you'll see your first tty
-      starts working
-    <braunr> for now i'll try a hack that starts the hurd console server before
-      the clients
-    <braunr> doesn't work eh
-    <braunr> tty1 is the only one started before runttys
-    <braunr> indeed, fixing /etc/hurd/runsystem.gnu so that it doesn't touch
-      tty1 fixes the problem
-    <gnu_srs> do you have an explanation?
-    <braunr> not really no
-    <braunr> but it will do for now
-    <pinotree> samuel added that with the comment above, apparently to
-      workaround some other issue of the hurd console
-    <braunr> i'm pretty sure the bug is already visible with cthreads
-    <braunr> the first console always seems weird compared to the others
-    <braunr> with a login: at the bottom of the screen
-    <braunr> didn't you notice ?
-    <pinotree> sometimes, but not often
-    <braunr> typical of a race
-    <pinotree> (at least for me)
-    <braunr> pthreads being slightly slower exposes it
-    <gnu_srs> confirmed, it works by commenting out touch /dev/tty1
-    <gnu_srs> yes, the login is at the bottom of the screen, sometimes one in
-      the upper part too:-/
-    <braunr> so we have a new open issue
-    <braunr> hm
-    <braunr> exiting the first tty doesn't work
-    <braunr> which makes me think of the issue we have with screen
-    <gnu_srs> confirmed!
-    <braunr> also, i don't understand why we have getty on tty1, but nothing on
-      the other terminals
-    <braunr> something is really wrong with terminals on hurd *sigh*
-    <braunr> ah, the problem looks like it happens when getty attempts to
-      handle a terminal !
-    <braunr> gnu_srs: anyway, i don't think it should be blocking for the
-      conversion to pthreads
-    <braunr> but it would be better if someone could assign himself that bug
-    <braunr> :)
-
-
-## IRC, freenode, #hurd, 2012-09-05
-
-    <antrik> braunr: the login at the bottom of the screen if from the Mach
-      console I believe
-    <braunr> antrik: well maybe, but it shouldn't be there anyway
-    <antrik> braunr: why not?
-    <antrik> it's confusing, but perfectly correct as far as I can tell
-    <braunr> antrik: two login: on the same screen ?
-    <braunr> antrik: it's even more confusing when comparing with other ttys
-    <antrik> I mean it's correct from a techincal point of view... I'm not
-      saying it's helpful for the user ;-)
-    <braunr> i'm not even sure it's correct
-    <braunr> i've double checked the pthreads patch and didn't see anything
-      wrong there
-    <antrik> perhaps the startup of the Hurd console could be delayed a bit to
-      make sure it happens after the Mach console login is done printing
-      stuff...
-    <braunr> why are our gettys stubs ?
-    <antrik> I never understood the point of a getty TBH...
-    <braunr> well you need to communicate to something behind your terminal,
-      don't you ?
-    <braunr> with*
-    <antrik> why not just launch the login program or login shell right away?
-    <braunr> what if you want something else than a login program ?
-    <antrik> like what?
-    <antrik> and how would a getty help with that?
-    <braunr> an ascii-art version of star wars
-    <braunr> it would be configured to start something else
-    <antrik> and why does that need a getty? why not just start something else
-      directly?
-    <braunr> well getty is about the serial line parameters actually
-    <antrik> yeah, I had a vague understanding that it has something to do with
-      serial lines (or real TTY lines)... but we hardly need that on local
-      cosoles :-)
-    <antrik> consoles
-    <braunr> right
-    <braunr> but then why even bother with something like runttys
-    <antrik> well, something has to start the terminal servers?...
-    <antrik> I might be confused though
-    <braunr> what i don't understand is
-    <braunr> why is there no getty at startup, whereas they are spawned when
-      logging off ?
-    <antrik> they are? that's fascinating indeed ;-)
-    <braunr> does it behave like this on your old version ?
-    <antrik> I don't remember ever having seen a "getty" process on my Hurd
-      systems...
-    <braunr> can you log on e.g. tty2 and then log out, and see ?
-    <antrik> OTOH, I'm hardly ever using consoles...
-    <antrik> hm... I think that should be possible remotely using the console
-      client with ncurses driver? never tried that...
-    <braunr> ncurses driver ?
-    <braunr> hum i don't know, never tried either
-    <braunr> and it may add other bugs :p
-    <braunr> better wait to be close to the machine
-    <antrik> hehe
-    <antrik> well, it's a good excuse for trying the ncurses driver ;-)
-    <antrik> hrm
-    <antrik> alien:~# console -d ncursesw
-    <antrik> console: loading driver `ncursesw' failed: Gratuitous error
-    <antrik> I guess nobody tested that stuff in years